Is disclosure imminent? In Dr. Steven Greer's view, recorded by Billy Carson in Washington on the eve of Greer's June 2023 conference and National Press Club event, the answer is yes: a whistleblower provision in the December 2022 defense bill had opened a legal path for witnesses, Greer says his Disclosure Project had 752 witnesses and a list of 145 facilities, and he had handed the whole archive to the Senate, the White House and the Pentagon. The mainstream record since then is more mixed. Congress did hold public UAP hearings, but the Pentagon's own review found no evidence of the reverse-engineering programs Greer describes, and his central claims remain his testimony rather than confirmed fact.
The interview was filmed days after David Grusch's first public interview and six weeks before the July 2023 House hearing, and it captures Greer's version of the whistleblower process from the inside. Carson asks the questions; the claims are Greer's. Where Greer names corporations or individuals in connection with alleged crimes, this article summarizes the allegation without the names.
Who is Steven Greer and how did the Disclosure Project start?
Greer describes himself as an emergency physician whose interest began with a daylight sighting in North Carolina in 1963, when he was about eight. In 1990 he started the CE5 contact initiative, and in 1992 a group training near Pensacola, including Air Force officers, saw four craft, an event that made the local front page and, he says, brought the intelligence community to his door. In 1993 he was asked to brief the incoming CIA director, James Woolsey, over a private dinner, and came away convinced that the president and the director were being kept from the subject by programs operating without oversight. That was the genesis of Project Starlight, later the Disclosure Project, which went public at the National Press Club in May 2001.
What is the SCIF whistleblower process?
About sixteen months before the interview, Greer says, a senior intelligence official who oversees the black budget asked him for "actionable intelligence": facility locations, project code names and the people involved, because the staff tasked by Congress with investigating UAP were "being gaslit." He says he provided the material, government field teams confirmed parts of it, and the finding was that both extraterrestrial and man-made craft exist, with the man-made technologies the larger secret.
The legal change he points to is real. The National Defense Authorization Act signed in December 2022 included a provision allowing current and former government and contractor personnel to report UAP-related information to the All-domain Anomaly Resolution Office, AARO, without penalty under their non-disclosure agreements, and Greer says he pushed for contractors to be covered because "the center of gravity in this is corporate." He sorts witnesses into three groups: those hostile to disclosure, those cooperating privately until protections for pensions, safety and amnesty are strengthened, and the handful willing to go on record. He says he has been paying travel and lodging for witnesses going into the SCIF, a secure compartmented information facility, and that some came out unhappy with how they were treated and whether their testimony would reach Congress. His solution is open hearings with sworn, subpoenaed witnesses, and he reads from an April letter in which Senate Intelligence Committee leaders complained about AARO's reporting.
The mainstream record: AARO was created in July 2022, the whistleblower channel exists, and in 2023 and 2024 members of both chambers publicly criticized AARO's responsiveness. AARO's March 2024 historical report concluded that it had found no verifiable evidence of extraterrestrial technology or of hidden reverse-engineering programs, and attributed many claims to misidentified classified projects. Greer's position is that AARO is "the fox guarding the hen house."
What is on the facilities list?
Greer says the list he was releasing at the Press Club named 145 top-secret facilities and corporate sites, every entry backed by witness testimony or documents, with two to four new whistleblowers arriving each month. He gives one example: an Army soldier from Fort Bragg taken into an underground facility where a multi-ton rectangular object floated inside an electromagnetic field. The larger holding, the Disclosure Project Intelligence Archive, runs to ten or twenty terabytes, and he asks for data engineers to make it searchable; Carson offers his own team, which catalogued more than a million NASA and ESA images over seven years.
Is the Tic Tac extraterrestrial?
No, says Greer: the object filmed by Navy pilots off San Diego in 2004 is a Lockheed Skunk Works craft. He says a witness saw an identical object offloaded from a C-130 in the Azores in 1991 and that multiple witnesses reported one in Pennsylvania in 1967. Commander David Fravor, the pilot who chased it, insists nothing human could move that way, and Greer's answer is that a Navy pilot would never have been read into a compartmented program.
The Navy and AARO classify the 2004 Nimitz encounter as unidentified; no agency has endorsed either the extraterrestrial or the Skunk Works explanation. Fravor and the weapons officer Alex Dietrich have given consistent accounts under oath, and the Azores and Pennsylvania witnesses have not come forward publicly.
What does Greer mean by a "rogue" program?
Greer distinguishes the legal black budget, which the president and oversight committees know about, from unacknowledged special access programs nested inside other programs "like Russian dolls" that have, in his words, gone rogue. He cites a 1990s briefing in which the head of the Defense Intelligence Agency told him he had been denied access, and a leaked memo attributed to the physicist Eric Davis describing Admiral Thomas Wilson, then intelligence director for the Joint Chiefs, being refused access and warned off. He quotes an early CIA director, Roscoe Hillenkoetter, to the effect that the secrecy around UFOs, not the objects, is the threat to national security.
He goes further: the programs, he says, have scalar electromagnetic systems that can penetrate any SCIF, neutrino detectors on satellites that register craft arriving from "transdimensional space-time," and weapons connected to them; his archive holds 121 cases in which craft were tracked, hit and brought down. The danger, as he frames it, is that an unsupervised group has weaponized technologies against visitors who are not hostile. "People want to know where the threat is: go look in the mirror."
The Wilson–Davis memo circulated in 2019; Wilson has denied the meeting it describes and Davis has not confirmed authorship, so its status is unresolved. Hillenkoetter did say, in a statement to Congress reported by The New York Times in 1960, that "unknown objects are operating under intelligent control" and that the Air Force should stop ridiculing witnesses. The claims about scalar weapons, neutrino tracking and 121 shoot-downs rest on witness accounts in Greer's archive and have no public corroboration.
What is The Lost Century, and does zero-point energy exist?
Greer's film The Lost Century and How to Reclaim It, released the week of the interview, argues that for a hundred years since Tesla, energy and propulsion inventions have been seized under national-security patent orders and their inventors silenced. He says anti-gravity was "mastered in October 1954," citing a scientist at the Naval Research Laboratory who saw the documentation, and that by the time he was born in 1955 the world should have had no jet engines, no oil and no coal. His pitch is practical: anyone with a working zero-point or quantum-vacuum device should contact him, funding is in place, and the condition is open-source release, because a patent would be seized. He predicts an end to poverty and pollution within twenty years of release and calls for retraining programs for workers in displaced industries. He adds one caveat: propulsion systems, in his conversations with military contacts, should stay classified for now.
The Invention Secrecy Act of 1951 is real, and several thousand secrecy orders are in force at any time, mostly on weapons-related patents. The Casimir effect, which Greer cites, is a measured consequence of vacuum fluctuations, but it is tiny and has never been shown to yield net energy; no over-unity device has passed independent testing. Floyd Sweet's "vacuum triode amplifier," featured in the film, was never reproduced under controlled conditions.
What does Greer want to happen next?
Three things. First, a civil lawsuit under the RICO statute, which he says a volunteer group of some fifty attorneys, organized by a public-interest lawyer he has mentored, is preparing to file against corporations and individuals involved. Second, open hearings, ideally in a House oversight committee, with amnesty and pension protection for witnesses. Third, pressure from the public: he asks viewers to write to their senators, their representative and the president, saying the Disclosure Project has given them everything they need. He also restates the legal theory behind his 1997 "Unless Otherwise Directed" letter to the Clinton administration: if the programs are illegal, the non-disclosure agreements that protect them are void, and a witness can leave a facility with evidence "with impunity."
Carson closes by urging viewers to watch the Press Club stream, recalling that the 2001 event "solidified my mind on what I thought was happening."
What happened after the interview?
The Press Club event went ahead on June 12, 2023. On July 26, 2023, the House Oversight subcommittee heard sworn testimony from Grusch, Fravor and the former Navy pilot Ryan Graves. The FY2024 defense bill carried a narrowed version of the UAP records provision after the stronger Schumer–Rounds language was cut, AARO's historical review followed in March 2024, and a further House hearing took place in November 2024. The RICO suit Greer described had not been filed by the time of this writing. For Greer's supporters the hearings vindicated his framing; for critics, AARO's findings showed the opposite.
Watch, read, listen
- Watch the full interview:
- The 4biddenknowledge Podcast archive: https://4biddenknowledge.ai/Podcast
- More in the category: UFOs & Extraterrestrials
- Related reading: Carson's earlier conversation with Dr. Greer on alien contact, Carson and Greer on the New Jersey drones, UAPs vs UFOs and the Disclosure Project testimony, the UAP hearings 2017 to 2026, the Nimitz Tic Tac explained, UFO crash retrievals with Michael Schratt, Roswell explained, Project Blue Book, Sign and Grudge and the 2023 shoot-downs.
Frequently asked questions
When was this interview recorded? In Washington on Friday, June 9, 2023, the day before Greer's two-day conference and three days before his National Press Club event on June 12.
What is a SCIF? A secure compartmented information facility: a shielded room where classified material can be discussed without electronic devices. The 2022 defense bill allowed UAP whistleblowers to give testimony to AARO in such a setting.
How many witnesses does Greer claim? 752 witnesses and whistleblowers, 145 facilities and 121 crash-retrieval cases, all in what he calls the Disclosure Project Intelligence Archive. These figures are his and have not been independently audited.
Does Greer think the Tic Tac was alien? No. He attributes it to Lockheed's Skunk Works. The Navy and AARO list it as unidentified, and the pilot who chased it rejects a human origin.
What did the Pentagon conclude? AARO's March 2024 historical report found no verifiable evidence of extraterrestrial technology or of secret reverse-engineering programs. Greer regards AARO as part of the cover-up.
Is zero-point energy real? Vacuum fluctuations are real and measurable through the Casimir effect, but no device has been shown to extract usable net energy from them.
Sources mentioned
- National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2023, UAP whistleblower provisions (December 2022)
- All-domain Anomaly Resolution Office, Historical Record Report Volume 1 (March 2024)
- Steven Greer, The Lost Century and How to Reclaim It (2023) and Unacknowledged (2017)
- The Disclosure Project National Press Club events, May 2001 and June 12, 2023
- The Wilson–Davis memo (circulated 2019)
- Roscoe Hillenkoetter statement on UFOs, reported by The New York Times, February 1960
- Invention Secrecy Act of 1951
- Hendrik Casimir, prediction of the Casimir effect (1948)
- House Oversight subcommittee hearing on UAP, July 26, 2023
